Members Present: Mona McCready, Carol Merrill, Jennifer Morin, William Barnett, Gabby Daneault, Robin McAfee, Robin Pelletier, Thomas Gilligan, Peter Viar, Evelyn Guilbeault for Tom Irzyk, Dan Howe, Larry Anderson and David Eaton

Excused Absent: Robin McAfee

Leave of Absence: Brian Duchesne

Others Present: David Jodoin, Fire Chief Chaput, and Rob Martin

Jennifer called the meeting to order at 7:00 p.m.

Mona made a motion to accept the minutes of the August 19, 2004 meeting as read, seconded by Dan. The motion passed with two abstaining votes (Robin P. and Evelyn)

Tom G. made a suggestion for future minutes. He felt that a note should be added to the minutes that state that the minutes are not verbatim. We run the risk of people thinking that the minutes are verbatim although they are very extensive and Peter and I were in here for three and half pages, we should have some sort of verbiage that states these are not verbatim, they are a really a caption of. Jennifer asked if they would be able to get this verbiage. Peter said he could make a copy of the last Planning minutes that has this statement at the bottom. Tom G. stated that it also quotes the RSA. Peter stated it has always been available, but it really dots and I’s and crossing the t’s. Jennifer stated that we had the tape if anyone needed it. Peter stated that when the minutes are lengthy people assume that they are verbatim, but not many minutes are. It just is a good idea.

Jennifer asked if any subcommittee members had attended the Selectmen’s meeting to review budgets and receive updates? Mona that she and Peter had attended the Highway review. Jennifer asked if it was useful. Mona stated that it was useful for the most part.

Jennifer stated that she just wanted feedback to see if this was useful and worth people’s time.

Carol stated that she had been to the building meeting and it was very useful.

Jennifer asked who had gone to the fire meeting. Dave and Dan. Dan stated that it had been very insightful. Peter stated that he thought it provided an opportunity for a different variation on the whole discussion with the Selectmen. It is not just dependent upon the numbers or hearing some of the discussions on why something has been cut. It really makes their job a little easier because they have to spend less time explaining it latter.

Larry stated that he had visited the new police department in Epsom; it was a very nice building and just what they needed. It could be just a little larger because of the number of people; it has a great design and is very useful. Jennifer asked if this was part of the facilities committee? Yes.

David asked if everyone had their expense reports? Yes.

Chief Chaput stated that this year the Department took a different approach as far as presenting the budget was concerned. This year we going with a little less information but tried to hit on the key areas that were really the biggest topic of discussion. That is where the explanation page comes into play. This page provides information on areas that Chief Chaput felt needed more explanation as opposed to hearing from him that is typically what is spent in a particular area.

Chief Chaput asked if the Committee wanted to go line by line, Mona stated that they needed to go line by line. Chief Chaput felt the process would be quicker this year, since last year he had spend three nights with the Selectmen and this year it was done in a little over two hours.

Chief Chaput stated that he had also provided a sheet on the proposed warrant articles for this year’s budget. There is also an amortization schedule regarding the trucks. Last year we asked for two vehicles, during the meeting with the Selectmen we decided it would be in our best interest to just ask for one this year. Although, he stands by the Department’s need for two apparatus, he also understands that this needs to be accomplished. So with this in mind, he has reduced the request to one vehicle and has provided an amortization schedule provided by the vendor. This schedule gives figures for 5, 7 and 10-year cost for a lease purchase. The proposal is for the seven-year lease, but it can be adjusted either up or down. But the Department has proposed a 7-year lease, the three schedules are attached with interest rates, payments, interest and any explanations.

Chief Salary – This request is for an increase of a little under $3,000, to a total of $8,400. This is based on trying to get the salary up to a reasonable rate so that you can attract someone for this position. The Board of Selectmen have only recommended $6,410. This is one of the areas that he felt more money could be added to. He has requested that the Budget Committee raise this amount to $7,400. Chief Chaput informed the committee that he may be getting done in April. With a salary of $5,410 the Town will have a hard time attracting candidates for this position, the salary has been at this rate since 1999. This department head oversees 32 employees, more than any other department head, and if you include building and trucks oversees capital of over $2 million.

Jennifer asked if this was the administrative salary part of the Chief’s salary, on call is on another line. Chief Chaput stated that the chief is paid $15.85 an hour for calls and is paid from part-time salaries.

Mona asked if there was a requirement that the Chief live in town? No, actually more than 50% of the department does not live in Town.

Part-time Salaries – The Department put in the same amount approved under the default budget of 2004, $44,520. Based on where the line is currently, we requested $48,000 but we cut that down. Last year the Budget Committee approved $47,150 but due to the default budget, it was reduced to $44,520 and that is where we have kept it this year. As we told the Selectmen it is hard to judge this amount, we could only spend $20,000 depending on how many people show up on the calls we have or we could spend $100,000 depending on what we have for call duration and the number of calls.

There is no fix, it is not like having full time employees around the clock and you know they are going to work 48 hours a week and they will be paid so much and then try to guess on overtime. This is a call salary, in 2004 the average was 3 people to a call and we paid out so much money. If in 2005 the average goes to 6 people per call, then you will essentially double with is paid out.

Jennifer asked if the people who are being paid this part time salary will be getting a step increase? Chief Chaput indicated that they are still planning for a step increase. The bottom line is what matters and if we have to move some funds from one area to cover it, this is what we will do. He has also initiated a spending frees and have informed the Board of Selectmen of this fact.

Jennifer stated that the Board likes to see that the Department is getting their 2.5% increase and this is not indicated here. Peter indicated that is just the way it is buried in this line, it is easier to see in full time salaries.

Jennifer asked if the Department still had the step increased or was it jut the 2.5% increase. Chief Chaput stated that it is just the 2.5% increase. Peter explained that the Selectmen look at the year to date expenditures, then have a discussion with the Department head to find out where they are and where they think they will go. The Board’s decisions are a combination of what has been spent in the current year and the input from the Chief during the discussion.

The Board made the decisions for the Selectmen’s revised number based on those two factors. A lot of areas where a reduction has been recommended is because we have not expended as much year to date. But every one of those recommendations is a guess. Everyone’s budget will be approached the same way. If we think we can get away with cutting a few bucks to help the bottom line, we will. But also bear in mind when you are looking at this sheet, remember the approved budget is the default amount. And as we go through all of these for the next two months, please remember all of the numbers are default. The Budget Committee actually approved a little over $260,000 for the Fire Department last year.

He suggested that it may be a good idea to also have the amount that the Budget Committee approved last year for each department.

Chief Chaput informed the Committee that the amount approved by the Budget Committee last year for the Fire Department was $260,139. The Selectmen recommended $258,453.

Stipend – On Call – There was $5,760 was year and so far the expenditures so far are relative low to non-existent. Last year there was a discussion regarding the Stipend program to have someone on duty 24/7. Jennifer asked if this was the summer program that had been discussed? Yes, and as you may recall the Committee revised the program and authorized $5,760 which essentially covered 7 days a week nights and weekends, beginning in June through September. He would like to say this program was successful, but it wasn’t as successful as he would have liked. People were not as excited at getting the $20 and making themselves available as we have hoped. So far only $700 has been spent.

The Chief requested that this line be reduced to $2,500 this year because he was going to try a different approach. Which would be tackle the holidays, which is really the biggest problem. January 1, Memorial Day, Labor Day, when everyone is going away. The proposed was to increase the stipend to $40 or $50 per shift that should attract someone in. The Selectmen have cut this amount to zero. He is asking that the Committee replace the $2,500 in this line. Although this has failed so far, we are trying something else. It was the first year and we are just trying to provide coverage for the citizens of Allenstown. If someone called with an emergency whether it is 2 a.m. or a Saturday, Sunday or Memorial Day or Christmas, you hope someone will respond. He is trying to provide some type of coverage so someone will respond. He is not trying to guarantee that this will work, and if we come back next year and it has not worked, they we could zero out this line and try something else.

Dan asked who would be paid this amount. Chief Chaput stated that it would be members of the Department who would be required to be at the station and cover for that time frame on a voluntary basis. The feedback is that for $20, it is not worth their time waiting for a call. What would be the regular wage if there was a fire? Chief Chaput stated that some are $9 per hour, some are $10 it all depends on what step they are. Then wouldn’t be better to pay them the same amount as they would make if they were working. Chief Chaput stated he agreed but, unfortunately, he is trying to put a program together that would be cost effective. The problem it is a 10-hour shift and it will cost a hundred something a shift, if it is a 14-hour shift, it will cost $140 give or take. It becomes much more expensive and it has to be more than one person. So you are really looking at 10s of thousands of dollars as opposed to trying to put some type of program together that, hopefully, will work. This is a work in progress.

Robin P. asked Peter why the Selectmen had zeroed out this line? Peter indicated that he had voted to keep this line at $2,500 because he was not part of the discussion last year because he was not on the board, but he felt that the Chief’s defense of the fact that it didn’t work because it was not enough money and this Board approved the money, so he presumed that this Board was sold on the idea, he felt it should not be thrown away because it did not work. He felt that since the Budget Committee approved it, he felt it should stay in the budget. The amount is less than half of last year’s amount, so lets see if it will work at $50 a shift. At least we will be guaranteed that someone will respond in a timely fashion. So his personal logic was, if the Budget Committee approved this last year, they were sold on it last year, he felt you would also be sold on it this year and it is half the amount of money just to try to make it work.

Robin P. asked if Peter knew why the other Selectmen had voted against this line item. Dave stated that he knew that Art was dead set against this and Sandy is looking to keeping the bottom line down. Chappy made a good point, we only tried it one year, as he said if it doesn’t work the next year, then get rid of it. Dan stated that he could see giving this a second chance. Why try something out because it did not work one time, that is foolish and a waste of $5,000.

Chief Chaput stated that last year when he brought this to the Board of Selectmen, they zeroed it out. He presented it to the Budget Committee and the Committee was the one that revised and reinstated the $5,760. Chief Chaput felt that Art and Sandy were against it last year and they still don’t support it this year. He is not criticizing anyone he just wanted to shed some light on this issue. Peter stated that they had stated that.

Tom G. asked how the $700 year to date had been broken out. Chief Chaput stated it was $20 per shift. David J. stated that there were three payrolls when someone had worked. One was on the payroll on June 9 for $160, the next payroll was for the 4^th of July weekend for $200 and August 4 for $340. Tom G. stated that his personal opinion was that $5,760 was too low. He stated that he would have to be paid $100 to sit around waiting to get paid. Is $2,500 going to be enough, how are you going to translate that in a per shift payout and what shifts are you planning to cover, i.e. how many weekends and how many holidays.

Chief Chaput stated this will be a revised trial. He does not want to just bump the amount up to $50 because you would have to up the amount to about $15,000. It would be broken down this way – you would be looking at $200 per holiday. It would be $50 per person, so $100 for a day shift and $100 for a night shift. This would give coverage for a 24-hour period. This would provide coverage for the major holidays, such as Memorial Day, Labor Day, 4^th of July, Christmas, etc. Chief Chaput stated it would be for the holiday only. If the holiday falls on a Friday, it would be on Friday, this would allow us to stay consistent with the coverage that the Town has now, which is Monday through Friday. The holidays themselves, i.e. Christmas, Thanksgiving are hard times to cover. People are usually around on a weekend and may respond. His thought is if we try out the $2,500 covering weekends, if it works, then next year we have a viable project, to try to cover more. If it fails, then we will have to try something different.

If Christmas falls on a Saturday, it would not be covered, but the holiday would be celebrated on Friday, so he would try to cover the Friday. The whole idea is to keep the station staffed Monday through Friday, plus the holiday evening. If the program works, then next year we can have the holidays and maybe the weekends in the summer.

Peter stated that if you take the nine major holidays that would be $1,800 leaving $600 for maybe three other days. So the logic would be to cover every holiday and then have a little money left over.

Tom G. asked if the idea was to raise the stipend from $20 to $50 times two guys per shift. Chief Chaput stated that they had not revised the policy yet, it was written after the program was approved and is based on the $20 per shift. He will not change the policy until this is approved. The feedback he has received so far from the guys is that they would be more likely to say yes to $50. The younger guys who do not wives and children are more likely the ones who will say yes to give coverage.

Chief Chaput stated he would really like to try the program this year and it is less than half of what was requested last year, granted the coverage is less than last year, but it is another attempt to try to improve the response, which is for the Town’s people. It is the taxpayer who call for the service and when thy are not there, the only one’s to suffer will be the taxpayers.

Dan asked if the $5,760 at $20, which is 288 shifts, what was the coverage for. Chief Chaput stated that the program began in June and ran through September, the intent was to cover Saturday, day and evening, Sunday, day and evening, Monday through Friday night. Initially a couple of signed up but it did not work the way we had hoped it would. Chief Chaput stated that you would need to divide the $5,760 by $40 that would give a total of 144 shifts, because each shift needs two people.

Jennifer stated that they had tried this program in the summer months because the trend had been that it was when they couldn’t get guys to show up.

Chief Chaput stated if you look at the same time frame you would need $14,400 to cover the same time. He felt it was not worth trying to shoot for this right now, because if it fails, it would then be a worse thing. He would rather start small and see what happens.

Telephones/Pagers - $4,000 was requested and approved by the Selectmen. The $1,000 increase is for new cell phones for E3 and cell phones for the Chief and Deputy which will be Nextel type which will give them connection between the Policy and other members of the Department who have Nextel phones at this point in time. This is approximately $50 per month.

Dispatch Service - $23,281 is a fixed cost and we have no control over this amount. The reason for this increase is that Concord Fire is going to two people per shift 24 hours a day. This number could go down, however it is not expected to. The budget is not fully approved, we have an approximate budget which will be voted on at the October meeting. Once this is done the amount will be official.

Jennifer asked if this amount could go up? Chief Chaput stated that this is the maximum number.

Copier and Office Supplies – Both these lines are unchanged. Robin P. asked if the copier maintenance bill had been paid yet. Chief Chaput stated that during the last couple of years, they have not done a maintenance contract on the copier. Typically, this pays for toner, paper, and other things associated with a copy machine. Robin P. asked if they had bought any supplies for the copier yet, Chief Chaput stated that he had, but had not turned in the invoice yet.

Dues and Publications - $1,650 – This is based on what the Department is expecting to pay out this year. This includes all the publications they receive as well as membership fees.

Postage – This is up by $10 because the Department has almost expended the $50 from last year.

Fuel – This line was kept at $3,000 even though there has been an increase in the cost of fuel. So far we are doing well fuel wise. The Department has not made a big oil purchase at this point, but the fuel line are on track and $3,000 should be ample, so we did not ask for any more there.

Custodial Supplies – We requested $1,000 but we accepted a reduction in that amount due to the fact that the actual cost is done this year, and he did not anticipate a huge increase to next year. So we felt comfortable at $500.

Public Education – This line was increased to $1,500 from $1,000. Last year the amount that was approved was $2,065 and we are only asking for $1,500. We are trying to get back into the schools. With the default budget, we had to make some cuts and unfortunately, the public education programs that we provide for the schools were cut. We needed to get fuel, we were able to meet the expenses of operating the department, we had to replace a couple of thing that we were not expecting, so some cuts had to be made. The intention was that we would have $500 to get back into the program. We will try our best to get back into the school this year.

Food - $400 – this line is used to cover if there is a major fire. During Mutual Aid, when other departments are here, this line covers this stuff. This is another line that is a guessing game. Some years, we only spend $200, some years we spend $400 on one fire.

Personal Protective Equipment – Last year, the Committee approved $5,000, we zeroed out this amount because we decided to tap our rainy day fund. There is a capital reserve for protective equipment and funds from this fund were used and this line item was cut to zero. This year, we are requesting $3,000; this covers boots, suspenders, helmets, hoods, gloves, etc. We are not asking for any money for gear this year. There is a proposed warrant article for $60,000 that is for $50,000 for airbags and $10,000 for gear. We shifted the funds over to there and Chief Chaput’s personal feeling is that they are better off doing that than making this a part of the operating budget. Therefore, it we need it the money is there, if not, then the money will gain interest and carries over to the following year. This line was reduced from $5,000 to $3,000 to cover miscellaneous things that we do have to buy.

Robin P. stated that the Board had approved protective equipment last year, Chief Chaput stated yes, they approved $5,000. Robin P. stated that she thought there was specific equipment that needed to be purchased. Jennifer stated that this line got cut due to the default budget. Chief Chaput stated that this line had been cut and they had used the capital reserve account to purchase what was needed for protective equipment.

Uniforms - $3,000 – this covers the uniforms for the full time guys, for all the call people who come in and the big thing that is in here is boots. These are station work boots which are required by our safety plan. We have not replaced a large amount of boots in the last seven years. There have been many boots that have worn out and we need to start replacing them. Last year there was $1,450 approved in this line and this year we have requested $3,000, which has been approved by the Board of Selectmen.

Other Equipment – This line is used to replace things like fire line tape, etc. Our request was cut from $2,000 to $500.

Equipment Testing – This is used to test things, for example if an extinguisher needs to be tested, this is the account that the payment comes out of. This covers every extinguisher the Department owns as well as anything that need to go out to be tested or for recertification. We had requested $3,500 but cut it down to $200.

Computer/Software – Last year approved at $1,500 this year request is for $4,000. The Board of Selectmen approved this amount at $3,000. The two big items is basically replacing two computers. We have some very old computers and we are having some problems with them. The computers would be for the radio room and one for the Chief’s office. This cost will include labor and the programs for the computers. Tom G. asked if this price included a maintenance agreement or warranty, have you priced them yet? Chief Chaput stated that they have ballpark figures at this point. Chief Chaput stated that he felt comfortable with the $3,000.

Full-time Salaries – this increased from $70,598 to $72,353 which includes the 2.5% rate increase.

Overtime/Coverage – Last year this amount was $12,730, we are pretty close to spending this entire amount. There is a limited amount of people to respond to calls.

Tools & Minor Equipment – Most of this covers the small item that we have saws, hand tools, etc. This year we are over on that line because of some unexpected things. We had a fatal fire in January on Pine Acres Road. One of our saws fell apart in the hands of one our guys while it was operating so it needed to be replaced. We also had to replace our K12 saw which was 12 or 14 years old because of a problem we found in it regarding it catching on fire. These two items had to be replaced and it was unexpected. The Department spent over $2,400 on these items. Basically this line covers a request for another saw as well as additional small tools and spark plugs and anything else that goes along with maintenance.

Jennifer asked if they should change Other Equipment to Tools and Minor Equipment to get the explanation to match up. Chief Chaput stated that yes, that is correct.

Hose & Fittings – The default amount was $4,000, last year the approved amount in Hose and Fittings was $7,239. So far we have spend $8,886 on Hoses and Fittings. We have been slow in replacing hose over the years. Last year when Chief Chaput brought this to the Board of Selectmen, he explained that hosing needs to be replaced on a regular basis. After that meeting when this was cut back, we had two lengths of hose that failed and blew, it then had to be replaced. The Chief’s intention is to try to replace x amount of lengths of hose per year. With the $5,000 requested, we would like to replace 5 lengths of 5" hose at approximately $700 per length, 8 lengths of 2" hose at approximately $500 per length and 1 nozzle at $300. Hose is one of the most important pieces of equipment we have, it gets water to the truck and then to the fire. When the hose starts to age and wear, every time there is a fire, the hose is dragged across the ground. Although it is much more durable than a garden hose, after 12 years failures start to occur on a regular basis so we need to be proactive and take care of this before it becomes a problem. We are trying to build in a way to bring the hoses up to date.

Pump Certification – this has been increased by $100 because we have gone from certifying three pumps to four pumps.

Rental/Leases – Chief Chaput requested that this line be reinstated at $1. Last year this was cut to zero and it has come to my attention that $1 keeps the account open. Chief Chaput would like this account to remain open in the event that we end up doing something where we need this line available.

Photography Supplies – Last year the Department cut this to $1, this year we would like it to be $100. This is just one of those things that when there is a fire, we need to take pictures, we can’t use a digital camera to document a fire because a digital picture can be enhanced or manipulated and therefore, not admissible in court. This line covers, film, processing, camera repairs, etc. Typically, we do not use all these funds, but we do need something there.

Printing – This line is at $100 and covers any printing that we may need such as business cards, forms, etc.

Fire Alarm Classes – This line has a $1, currently we are very lucky because we have Don Peloquin who is retired from the City of Concord and was a fire alarm tech for the City of Concord. He takes care of things for us and does a great job, at relatively no cost. In reality, Don is getting older, he is already retired from his regular job and he may be retiring from here in a couple of years. The outside cost of doing this work is outrageous, approximately $200 per hour. We would like to just leave this line open so that down the road we can put some money there to start sending someone to school to be able to do this. Next year, you may see some money in this line.

Alarm Maintenance - $500 – this is the cost for the fire alarm maintenance at the Fire Department.

SCBA Maintenance – There was $7,400 in this line under the default budget and in the approved budget. This amount covers everything from the testing that needs to be done to the new bottles that new to be purchased. The bottles have a DOT lifespan of 15 years, it doesn’t matter if they have been used once or a million times, at 15 years they are out of service. This year we need to replace three cylinders at $980 each as well as testing, repair and replacements associated with SCBA and breathing air compressor. This includes thing like face pieces that need to be replaced, because we have numerous ones that are starting to show dry rot. They are a rubber type of material, just like tires, and when they start to show dry rot, they need to be replaced. These are one of the most important pieces of equipment we have because it provides air to the fire fighter inside the building. It is very important that we keep these up to date. So we are looking at spending $8,000 this year and there is not a whole lot of room on this line for movement.

Jennifer stated that there is not much money left in this line right now, is it done for the year? Chief Chaput stated that they are over this year because they had a couple of bottles that needed replacement that we were not expecting. Last year we budgeted for three and a couple were out of service that he was not aware of that we needed to buy this year. As you may recall, last year we stated that we wanted to purchase 7 this year, four of them were purchased last year and that is why this request is reduced to three. However, with the other pieces of equipment that need to be replaced, like the face pieces, HUD receivers and other required items, they tally up to $8,000.

Rescue Tool Maintenance - $500 – this is for repairs as well as maintenance for the Herstal. That includes the hoses, fluids, and everything associated to the rescue tool. Typically this account is saved until the end of the year.

Fire Supplies – This line remains at $1,000.

EMS Supplies - $,4000 – this is a big change. The last few years, we have requested a budget that has been a little bit higher. We do a lot of EMS calls, do a lot of backup and a lot of first responses when we get there ahead of the ambulance. This year we found numerous items that were either out of date or broken or non-existent. So far we have spend $1,845 to date and the Selectmen have just signed a purchase order for $907 for supplies. We already had to replace one of the suction units which was used on a patient, it was placed out of service immediately after that. We had to buy a new glucometer this year and we were amazed to find out that we did not have a pulse ox. The department went on two different calls this year when we did not this simple piece of equipment to use on the patient, and as Chief I was embarrassed and appalled. The PO came up immediately to the Selectmen the next day requesting those items.

We found we have a deficiency in a lot of areas. We have personnel who are trained as EMT’s and a Paramedic level who can’t even do a basic assessment because we are missing items. A glucometer which checks the blood sugar in someone, a pulse ox shows the oxygen content in a person’s blood, tells you what their pulse is, just simple things which we are missing. They are relatively priced items, usually a couple of hundred dollars each.

We took on Ron Adinolfo who was the Chairman for Tri-Town Ambulance; he is now our EMS coordinator for the Fire Department. His recommended budget for this year was $9,550, so you can see the Chief cut this down, but he did take into consideration what he was looking at. The Chief did stress the $4,000 that is in this line is important in getting the Department up to where it need to be equipment wise.

Rescue Supplies – This line was cut back to $500,

Hazmat – same explanation $1.00

Training – Outside Instructor – This covers all costs for outside classes at $5,000. This includes Fire Fighter I, Fire Fighter II, career level classes that the Department has to send people to. We have just recently taken on three new members and three people waiting. It is great that we are bring on these new people, but when you have new people, there are costs associated with this, such as gear, training, insurance. We need to provide the classes to these people so that they can be certified and able to respond. You can’t just bring people on, they must go to classes to be certified.

Training – In House – which is basically payroll training. There was $8,500 last year, the Chief requested $9,500 this year, we agreed on $8,000 based on where we are so far and we are comfortable that the Department can survive with $8,000 in this line.

Fire Signal Service – This line has a $4,000 reduction. This covers part of the Main Street project being done this year, which we were told wasn’t going to happen and is now happening. Our understanding is that Main Street is going to be completed during this budget cycle, which means the money we have in the budget for that will be used for that and that project will be taken care of. So this was reduced from $6,000 to $2,000 that is normal maintenance on the system, meaning all the boxes that are on the street, fire alarm cables, etc.

Radio Purchases - $5,400 – The major increase on this line is based on pagers. The Department is looking to purchase five pagers that will cost $3,800. Taking on new people, we are out of pagers and some of the pagers we have are broken and out of service and beyond repair.

Radio Maintenance – There is no change in this line of $1,675.

Vehicle Repair Parts – No change at $4,500. These are the parts that are used and it is a guessing game. I read in your last minutes that it was asked if the Department was holding off repairs or have they just been lucky. Well, it has been a little of both. We are holding off on repair that don’t need to be done at this point and we are trying to put off some repairs until the end of the year or possibly until the beginning of next. We have been lucky, we have not had major breakdowns this year. Right now inspections are going on and he feels that in the next two weeks is when we will have repairs that we were not expecting to come up.

Ground Ladder Certification – No change at $500.

Physical/Shots – This line had been increased to $1,000 based on the fact that as we take on new employees, we need to send them for physical/shots. However, we agreed upon cutting this down to $500 and hope this will enough if not, then we will have to take the funds from another account.

Jennifer asked if people have insurance won’t it pay for this? Chief Chaput indicated that the problem with that is that becomes a burden on them. When the Chief has his physical for the Fire Department Hudson, it is not my insurance that covers this, it is their responsibility to pay that bill, just like it is the Town of Allenstown’s responsibility to pay the bill for someone going for a physical for the fire department. The second problem is that this is not typical physical. They need to have breathing test, different blood work, EKG’s are done.

Electricity and Heat – We have increased both of these by $1,000. If you look at this year’s budget we will be going over the $5,000 that was allotted. The electricity cost has gone up. The same thing with the heat, it is a big building to heat. The heat is on an automatic censor; it does down during the night and back up during the day.

Water - $600 – no request for increase.

Sewer - $200 – no request for increase.

Building Maintenance & Repair – The Selectmen kept this line at $2,000. Unfortunately, we no longer have someone who is overseeing buildings and grounds. There was a fire department report that came from the insurance carrier last year which had a bunch of items listed that needed to be taken care of. One of those items was enclosing the stairway to the second floor. This is not approved in this budget. The reality is we were looking at about $5,000. Chief Chaput is not asking for $5,000, he is only bring to the Board’s attention that this is something that we will be faced with having to fix. It is on the report that the Board of Selectmen have somewhere. That as well as enclosing the boiler at the Fire Station that is in the maintenance room. The enclosing of the maintenance room is not a big issue, it would not be expensive. The stairwell will be a much more expensive. He is bringing this to the attention of the Committee. At the end of 2005 this budget is not fully expended and there is enough money, the Department will probably submit a PO requesting that this work be done.

Chief Chaput stated that the Department will be underfunded in this area, but he did not ask for more and is not asking for more, he just wanted the Committee to know this information. Jennifer asked if these issue have been outstanding since the building opened? Yes, these were thing that they thought would not be an issue, but when the Municipal Association came through the building, they said we can’t have this, you can’t have this, you have to do this. As you know, the second floor of the fire station is not completed. The stairwell from the first to the second floor exists and need to be enclosed.

Jennifer asked what this all meant, Chief Chaput stated that the Municipal Association has come through and pointed out deficiencies within the building which need to be taken care of. Some of them were as simple as junk items being piled where they shouldn’t be, electrical panels not being cleared. Those things have all been taken care of. All of the things that had no money or very little cost associated with them have been taken care of. The intent of last year’s budget was to start tackling some of those items, however, with the default budget, there was no money to even think of taking care of this stuff. Out of site, out of mind, for lack of a better excuse Chief Chaput stated he had not thought of the report while the budget was being written. It was not until we started discussing it the other night that he realized that he had not included any money for these repairs.

Jennifer asked what would happen if something happened at the Fire Department? David J. stated that each Town or City is required to have Safety Committee that go from building to building and review what is going on with the building, where the deficiencies are and they write up a report, per our insurance carrier. Chief Chaput stated that typically, the Fire Department is the one that goes and does it to everybody in Town, they are the ones that come and do it to us.

Jennifer asked if there was a fire on the second floor of the building, would the insurance company not cover it. Peter stated that it is more the liability of people, the second floor is not really used right now because it is not finished. It is a long-term potential liability if it is not taken care of, yes.

Chief Chaput stated that if you look at the current bottom line of $258,453, which is less than what was approved last year. As you look at this budget, please keep those additional things that are not approved in this budget in mind as potential fixes in the event there is extra money at the end of the year.

Dan asked Chief Chaput what would need to be done to the stairwell? Chief Chaput stated that in order to do this correctly, you are looking at a fire rated door at the second floor, completely finishing the stairs, sheet rocking, insulating, sheet rocking and to do it right the way it was supposed to be done, we were looking at having an 1R rating ceiling put in at a lower height and allowing for that to be built as a structural supporting floor because the area that is in the stairwell is a huge uncapped recourse for storage for the Department. As long as we meet the code, we can do that. The other money that goes along with that is finishing the fire alarm that needs to be finished as part of that stairwell. Bringing the sprinklers into there, which are required, so this is what we were looking at.

We did not even begin to tackle the second means of egress, which they put on that is needed on the second floor. Our reasoning is that the second floor is not regularly used. People go to that second floor because there is storage on the second floor. People are not up there for any length of time. We would be looking at ten’s of thousands of dollars to close it properly and have a second means of egress in order to make in functional. We are not looking at this at this point of time. The other thing that were on there were electrical issues and all but one of those have been taken care of.

As for closing off the boiler room, if you go into the building, there is a mechanical room in the back left corner, he thought that when the building was designed, he felt that the mechanical room confused people. This room is really a mechanics room, not a mechanical room. This room is where the oils, tools, etc. are stored. The furnace that is in there is what provides the heat for the two gear rooms, for the decon shower room, the storage room and that room. This also needs to be enclosed and separated by the rest of the room by a 1R rating as required by code.

How can this happen in a brand new room? He can only give you his interpretation, when they looked at the plans, he think that mechanic and mechanical were confused as being one and the same into being one in the same.

Grounds Maintenance - $1 – We try to beautify the station a little bit. It is the newest building and it is an eye sore on the outside. The grass is horrible, the plants and landscaping is horrible. He understands that the people need to keep their own house in shape, and not to use tax money to beautify the Fire Station. The default budget cut this line to zero, the Committee cut it back to $1,000 so this year we would like to keep this line at $1 to keep it open and hopefully, down the road we can start doing something to make the outside of the station look decent.

Robin P. asked if there were expenditures in this line, yes $72, there was no money in this line, how can you spend money from this line. David J. stated that technically, as long as they do not go over the bottom line, they can spend it where they want. Robin P. stated that it has always been that if there is no money budgeted, we don’t spend on it. David J. stated that there is a lot of lines like this, there are some in the Police and Highway budget.

Peter stated that under the Municipal Budget Law, the bottom line is the important thing. Peter stated that the Selectmen may have chosen the coding. His philosophy as far as coding bills is, put it where it belongs. If the Town uses money for something, whether it has a zero or nor, it will be put there because he wants this Committee to know that money has been expended in that item.

Robin P. stated that historically this has not been accepted. Peter asked if she would rather know or have them hide the expense somewhere else. Robin P. stated that she would rather know.

Jennifer asked if there were any questions on any of the lines? Robin P. asked about the sewer line, are there going to be any expenses for the sewer this year. Chief Chaput stated that they usually see one bill a year.

Jennifer asked if there were any questions on the areas that Chief Chaput had highlighted for the Committee to take an extra look at, which are chief salary and stipend/on call.

Chief Chaput stated that the bottom line is about $1,700 less than what was approved last year, right now, the Departments request of $272,073 has been cut to $258,453 so there has already been some significant cuts.

Larry made a motion to make the Stipend/On Call line $2,500, Jennifer seconded. The motion passed with one no vote (Carol) and one abstaining vote (Mona).

Tom G. made a motion to raise the Chief’s salary to $7,400, Peter seconded. The motion passed by a vote of 8 yes, 3 no and 1 abstaining vote (Robin P.)

Larry asked if $3,000 was enough in the computer line. Chief Chaput stated he would love more money, but we must pick and choose. The breakdown as we had requested, the radio and chief’ PC replacement at an estimated cost of $800 each for a total of $1,600, outside labor from private companies was estimated to be $1,625. Hardware repairs at $250, Preventive Maintenance at $200, Software at $250, Fire Department Web Page – one year - $185 for a total of $4,110.

There are things that we have cut down, such as labor and we should be able to get by with this money. We are making headway, which is important and Chief Chaput felt comfortable leaving this line at $3,000.

Larry asked if $500 is going to be enough in the Physical and Shots line? Chief Chaput stated that the Department has spent a larger amount than is reflected in this year’s expenditures. We just had three guys go for physicals, so we will spend the $500 plus. All the hires that we have now are coming in this year, but if you look at the last few years, $500 has been enough. To try to make the budget better, the agreement with the Board of Selectmen was to try to leave this line at the same number and the worse case we will have to rob from Peter to pay Paul and hopefully balance everything out at the end of the day. Do I really think $500 will be enough, no.

Larry asked if $1,000 would be enough, Chief Chaput stated that yes it would be better, but he is not asking anyone to increase it, he is actually pretty happy with this budget where it sits right now. If we don’t end up with a default budget this year, a budget that is similar to last year will be very workable.

Larry asked is there was money to set aside to make the repairs to the fire station? Peter stated that honestly, he does not have an opinion because he just found out about it and does he think there will be money available at the end of the year, it is possible.

Jennifer stated that she felt the Chief was comfortable with the $2,000 in Building Maintenance and that the Chief was just bringing these issues to the Committee’s attention.

Chief Chaput stated that he just wanted to bring these issue to the Committee’s attention. He stated that he is fairly pleased at where the budget has ended up at this point. It is more or less where the Budget Committee had put it last year. He is happy at where we are and he fells that the Department can move a lot of things forward. We made a lot of progress this year with the default budget. Would he like to see more money in this line, yes, but he did not want to press it to a point that the Town has a default budget again.

Gabby made a motion to accept the bottom line for the Fire Department of $261,943, Mona seconded. The motion passed unanimously.

Chief Chaput indicated that as part of the default budget, the Fire Department absorbed this entire budget. There are three lines under the Forestry budget, they are part-time salaries, supplies and vehicle maintenance. Last year’s default budget was zero. The 2005 department request mirror images your approved budget for 2004. For 2004 the Committee approved $3,500 for salaries, $3,000 for supplies and $1,000 for vehicles. After meeting with the Board of Selectmen and looking at where the budget was again this year, again there are some years when we overspend this budget by $10,000 and other times under spend the budget. It all depends on how busy, the type of calls and the duration of the calls.

The Department agreed with the Board of Selectmen to remove the part-time salary expense and leave it in the Fire Department budget. The $3,000 that is in the supply line is for fire supplies for forestry, insurance, goggles, things that are moved from the Fire Department budget into this budget where they actually belong. Vehicle Maintenance covers maintenance on the forestry vehicles, the tanker, etc. A lot of this is here because of matching funds, i.e. if we have a grant for forestry gear and we have a budget for it, matching funds come out of it.

The request for Forestry is $4,000, which is $3,500 less than last year’s request and the Budget Committee approved.

Larry asked about the part-time salaries, so you ended up taking this out of the Fire Department Part-Time salaries? Chief Chaput stated yes, that they had decided to keep all funds this year in the same line. It was easier for David to track, there was a discussion regarding the $3,500, but we felt we would be fine with that money. We may have enough, we may not, if we don’t, we will just have to move money into the account.

Larry made a motion to accept the bottom line of $4,000 for the Forest Fire budget, Tom G. seconded. The motion passed unanimously.

Chief Chaput stated that this is now known as Emergency Management.

This is a mirror image of last year’s approved budget with the exception of the additional $200 which was put into building maintenance. As was discussed with the Board of Selectmen this year, one of the things that is happening this year is that there are a lot of grants available for emergency management. There is a two-fold problem right now. One is that there are no matching funds, second there is no money in place after last year’s budget to do anything such as updating the master plan for the Town regarding Emergency Management and Response. We were also talking about getting the Fire Department actually set up as the Emergency Management Center.

He realizes that we are not Florida and about to get hit with third hurricane in less than three weeks, however, we are New Hampshire and we do have blizzards, northeasters, things that could facilitate the opening of the Emergency Management Center or at least staffing it with personnel. The money that is in here is stuff to use to keep the building up to date and to get things ready. The new building is not out of date, we are only referring to the Emergency Management room. Which has maps, which we started to work on last year, different tables for charts etc. This just encompasses everything that is involved in emergency management.

If we go line by line, we have Equipment Maintenance - $200

Telephone Usage - $100 – this comes into play we use Emergency Management and need additional lines.

Jennifer noted that the copy of the budget that the Committee had did not have the Selectmen’s approved budget. David J. indicated that they are the same numbers.

Chief Chaput stated that these are all things that are used for emergency management. In 2004, this was budget was cut and moved into the Fire Department budget. The $1,600 was approved and spent between January and March updating and getting things done.

Generators – $2,000 – this is not to purchase generators, this is a maintenance contract to maintain all the generators in Town including the ones at the School and at the Town Hall.

Equipment Furnishing – we are getting back to map boards and things that we need to have.

The $500 that is in Training and Equipment, one of the things that we haven’t done and need to do is a drill. We are as a Town lost – the Chairman of the Board of Selectmen is technically in charge. When this was brought to her attention last year, she was surprised to learn she was in charge; she has had no formal training. That is something that needs to be done. We need to start doing some of these things that we have not been doing and be prepared so that in the event of some type of disaster of any sort, we are ready to go and ready to act in the best interest of the Town of Allentown.

The money in this budget represents the small items that we need to get out Emergency Management division up and going.

Robin P. stated that she thought there were some grants out there, David J. stated yes, through the Office of Homeland Security. Chief Chaput stated that there is a two-fold problem, one is that there is very large packet that needs to be filled out, that last year’s Board of Selectmen voted to not fill out. Based on the fact that we needed this information in by Friday and this was a Monday. Hind site being 20/20, they said we should have just gotten in to them. Until that packet gets to them, the grants do not exist.

Problem #2 is that 90 plus percent of these grants are all matching fund grant. So if we get a grant for $500 we need to be able to come up with $500 to match that they will give us. None of the grants are free.

Robin P. stated that she thought there were some free grants. David J. and Chief Chaput stated that the Town is not poor enough. All the grants that we are eligible for, we don’t have matching funds to match them and we have not finished the paperwork.

David J. stated that the Police get their grants through the Highway Safety, which is a different organization. So they do not have to go through the Homeland Security Office. Chief Chaput that there are Homeland Security grants that are specifically set up for the fire department and ones specifically set up for the Police Department.

Gabby made a motion to accept the Civil Defense bottom line of $4,400, Larry seconded. The motion passed unanimously.

This is for the Committee’s information only, not to vote on tonight.

#1 – last year the Department asked for $655,000 to purchase two fire apparatus. This year Chief Chaput put in a request for $755,000, which represented the exact same two vehicles at their increased price. When this was brought to the Board of Selectmen, it was met with let’s pick and choose our battles and try to get something that is a winner. Chief Chaput really wants to win this battle and we are a point now where we make some strides forward.

Therefore, we have cut the request down to one vehicle. However, for the record he would like to state again that, in his opinion, we would be fiscally better off to go for the two. However, I realize that when you look at the payment and try to explain it to the public and try to get it through, it will be a tough sell. So he is willing to go for the one and concentrate on that.

We have cut this down to a rescue pumper and have cut this request to $400,000. Bear in mind that this is the high figure. This is what you would be asked to approve, once it goes out to bid that is what we would be paying. Hopefully, we are hoping to be under $400,000. The original estimate was $390,000 to $395,000. We rounded this off to $400,000 just to be safe. Once again we are looking at March, when the price increases. Just to give you an example, the Engine 3 that was just delivered and was approved two year ago at $320,000 today is $365,000.

This rescue pumper will replace the oldest engine, which is Engine 2 a 1976 American LaFrance, and Rescue 1, which is a 1986 Ford Reading Rescue Body. This is the truck that is in need of some $28,000 in repairs. If this does not get approved, we will have to revise this because we are at the point that we either replace it or spend $28,000. Is $28,000 a lot of money, now, but we paid $28,000 for this truck when it was new.

There are three amortization schedules, one for five years, seven years and ten years. Five years ends up being $87,480, seven years ends up being $65,484 a year which is $10,000 less than the annual request last year, ten years ends up being $49,315. Ten years is not a bad idea, except you end paying $93,000 in interest versus paying $58,000 on the seven year.

Tom G. asked if this new truck really would replace two old ones? Yes. Tom G. asked what the combined total of two new trucks was last year? Chief Chaput stated that the combined total was $655,000, the year the combined total was $755,000.

#2 - $60,000 request for Capital Reserve #00009117903183 Fire Safety Equipment, $10,000 for gear as was discussed during the budget, that replenishes the money that was already taken out. It also gives us a good amount of cash in that account to spend on gear. Instead of asking for money for gear in the budget each year, it will be here to use. Next year we will ask for a lesser amount, but right now we have exhausted this account. We used this account to purchase gear that was needed and we do need to buy gear for the firefighters. It does not end up not being spent or spent on something else in the Fire Department budget because we ran out of money someplace else.

The $50,000 represents the first year of a two-year installment of SCBA replacement, which was included in the CIP for the Town. If you read the CIP, one of the several requests that the Fire Department put in was for breathing apparatus. You see the amount of money that is being spent right now on breathing apparatus maintenance, repair and upgrade, the SCBA are getting very old and are in need of replacement. We anticipate that the cost will be approximately $100,000, what the CIP asked us to do is to break this down into a two year purchase by putting the money into capital reserve. So $50,000 is half of that amount and we thought it was a good idea.

The next two are basically accounts that the Department maintains. Cistern and Hazardous Materials, typically $1,000 per year are placed in these funds. These accounts sit there in the event there is any malfunction in one of the cisterns or a necessary repair or if we have to actually build one ourselves.

Hazmat is one of those accounts, if someone comes in and there is a spill in Town that is the account that pay that bill and then we recollect any money for the spill which then goes back into this account.

#5 - $22,900 for a Digital Box Alarm Communicator. Last year there was a request for $18,900 for that same item. That item was removed, we are again bringing this forward as a request, we have removed the Digital Repeater System that was in place and moved to Concord. It was outdated and no longer working. When we disconnected ourselves from Concord, because Concord was going to charge the businesses in Allenstown $150 a year, we decided not to continue this service.

So now when a call comes in, the box blows and the page goes out to respond to the Station for an incoming box. The guys have to go to the station to read the box, notify fire alarm, then the alarm is retransmitted. Is there a delay in response? As of now, no there hasn’t been. The problem is that when the full time guys are not there and no one shows up to read the box, which has not happened yet.

The Digital Communicator reads the alarms and transmits it to the alarm receiving company, right now that is Capital Alarm, Capital Alarm notifies the dispatchers and he then dispatches the call.

Number 6 is a new request that was not on the original request to the Board of Selectmen. The reason for this has been added is that by reducing the apparatus down from two to one, this was going to be something we were going to ask for next year, so Chief Chaput decided to move it up to this year.

This is a request for $30,000 for a new pickup (utility) with plow. The one that is being used now is a 1986 GMC pickup, which we received second hand from the Police Department, which they got rid of because it was not running. In reading minutes from both the Budget Committee and the Board of Selectmen it was stated that they would not spend any more money on this vehicle to keep it running. The Department is responsible for plowing both our facility and at times we also plow out the Police Department because Jimmy is not available. Last year, with breakdowns in the truck, we could not do to many times.

The utility truck is used by the guys instead of using a fire truck, to haul equipment back and forth to a fire, hoses, etc. It is a necessity that we really need. After discussion with the Board of Selectmen, he decided to put it in this year. The breakdown comes out to take $17,000 from capital reserve for fire apparatus and the remainder would be raised by taxes.

Larry asked when this will be discussed. Peter stated that typically all the warrant articles are discussed at the same time. David J. stated that all articles need to be in by January 13.

Jennifer stated that normally we have meeting to start looking at the warrant articles in December, but it is good to have them early to be able to review them.

Peter stated that they have asked everyone to submit them with their budget request.

Tom G. stated that the Committee votes on the warrant articles at the end all together, and then we can see the total impact.

Dan asked if these figures were realistic. Chief Chaput stated yes, but bear in mind, if the interest rates are raised 2 points, in which case the numbers would no longer be accurate. Based on projected interest rates they are accurate as of today. With the meeting in March, the bids would not go out until April or May. Chief Chaput stated that the cost is between $390,000 and $395,000 so there is a buffer built into to that particular article. Unfortunately when you are dealing with that type of money you have to allow some buffer just in case.

Chief Chaput wanted to clarify some things, he had read minutes of the Committee’s April meeting, and there were come questions brought up regarding letters the Fire Chief wrote pertaining to the apparatus being asked for at the March Town Meeting. Specifically, it was stated that the letter from the Fire Chief stated that he only had four minutes of the Committee’s time to go over the warrant articles.

The night the Committee meet to go over warrant articles, the same night Chief Chaput had a meeting with the Board of Selectmen downstairs. He was not notified of this meeting, until he arrived at the meeting downstairs. By the time the Selectmen were finished the Board’s meeting was finished. He spoke with Jennifer and left messages for all members of the Budget Committee asking them to call him so that he could explain the warrant article and what it was about, he received two phone calls.

The Chief asked Jennifer if he could meet with the Budget Committee prior to the public hearing that was held and was told to meet after the meeting. When he arrived at the meeting, at about 6:56 Jennifer informed him that if he wanted to discuss the warrant article it had to be done before the meeting started. He just wanted to stress that his statements were accurate as to what took place. If he is not told about meeting and asked to be there, he cannot present a budget or warrant article. The Chief just wanted to be clear that there was no intent on his part to make anyone look bad, other than to state the facts. It wasn’t like the Chief had a whole meeting to go over the warrant article with the Budget Committee to explain the ins and outs of it. There was a brief discussion about it when the rescue pumper was actually brought to the Fire Station and the Committee was afforded an opportunity to actually look at the truck the Department was looking to purchase.

Just for a point of clarification that what was written in those letters is accurate and was certainly not meant to smudge anyone or make anyone look bad. It was intended to get facts out to the public so that they understood where we stood on that particular warrant article.

Carol stated that the way she read it in the paper was that the Committee only gave him a few minutes completely; we spend two nights with you. Jennifer stated it was not in regards to the warrant article. Carol also stated that she did not get a phone call from the Chief, she has an answering service because she has a business. She would have called the Chief back. Chief Chaput stated that he went through the list that he had and the phone numbers that were on that list. Some people answered and whoever did not answer he left a message. The only person he did not reach was Henriette Girard who spoke with him after.

Jennifer stated that there was a lot to do at the very end and she honestly thought that they could discuss the warrant article after. Moving forward this year, we changed the schedule; we have folks going to the Selectmen’s meeting with Department Heads. We learned a lot from last year and are moving forward this year. You have given us this information ahead of time and it will give us plenty of time.

Chief Chaput stated he applauded the efforts of the Budget Committee this year. Doing things the way we have this year has worked out great. As a department head, he is really happy to be done in two committee’s in less time it took to get through the Selectmen last year. He was just referring to that particular warrant article where there was no meeting set up. He realized that this was beyond anyone’s control; he just wanted people to be aware of that. Chief Chaput gave the Committee members his cell phone number and said if anyone has questions, please call him. If it is not a good time to talk, he will let them know.

Jennifer stated that the next order of business is to create the agenda of the budgets the Committee will review at their next meeting and pick the date. Does the Committee want to meet in two weeks, September 23? David J. stated that Building and Code Enforcement, and many small ones. The Selectmen reviewed all of these in one night.

Jennifer asked if the Highway Department was ready with the exception of the amount in the Penacook line. David J. stated there are two variables Penacook and Paving.

Peter stated that the packet that was distributed tonight contains budgets that have been reviewed by the Board of Selectmen. It would be great if everyone would review them before the next meeting.

Tom G. asked if the Committee was going to schedule time to talk about the rumor? Jennifer stated that they would do that on the 23^rd. Tom G. asked why the Committee did not officially talk about this issue because he has questions that he would like the School to answer. He would like to say what the questions are and that he wants answers to at the meeting.

We are talking about an issue that we talked about last year. Which is how long are they going to have this building, which was two years. We said they could have it for two years. Plan A that they were committed to was adding on to the elementary school and now we have a whole other plan. He felt that they needed some serious done by that committee and the school department and come to us with real numbers instead of just having a touchy/feely discussion.

Tom G. would like to see enrollment numbers for 2004, projected enrollment numbers for 2005. He want to know what research they have done for acquiring land, because his estimate is $1 million for land for a new K-8 building and what their hard estimates are from other Towns that have recently undertaken this are for building a K-8 building. He does not want touchy/feely discussions. We have had too much of them and they take up too much time. He is assuming the cost of a new building is anywhere from $5 to $10 million. Peter stated that it is $10 to $13 million. Peter stated that there is a 36-acre property available for $200,000.

Tom G. stated that he wants those numbers presented to the Budget Committee on paper when we get to that part of the discussion.

Peter stated that the discussion they had in both committees last night was that, every stone needs to be turned over and that all the details relative every option needs to be made available. There has always been concern in the past about providing too much information. He said he did not want anyone in the audience who lives in this Town to ask a question that we did not think of. He said he wanted to know what all the option are relative to all of the buildings including, purchasing, leasing, and buying. Shawn is doing a really nice job on the Town side for the Highway and the Police Department. I know the School has done a lot of work on their side. We had an excellent meeting of the two committees last night, probably one of the first times that he could recall. We took the time to share the ideas that are around the table from both sides to say how do we all benefit from what has to be done. At the end of the day it is one taxpayer dollar, it doesn’t matter if it is School or Town, it is still one taxpayer dollar.

Peter stated that relative to land, they have done some investigation, but they, like us, are well ahead of the curve on building an addition. They had all of that – what it will cost, where it will go, what the implications are. The idea of us taking one of their buildings as a Town building, kind of threw them a curve ball. He told them last night, we may screw you up and slow you down. We committed that we would have to them by December 1 our analysis of what it would cost the Town to take the AES building and convert it into basically three offices – Police Department, all the Town offices and the Recreation Department all within that one building.

Leaving the Highway Garage out of the mix, they don’t belong in that building or in that neighborhood. The school has indicated that they have three options – 1) build a new K-8 building; 2) build a new K-5 building, keep ARD, we end up with that building and a new K-5 building; or 3) just build an addition. And if you want to be skeptical you can say there is a fourth option, which is to do nothing.

The three realistic options is a new K-8, a new K-5 or an addition to AES. Those are really their three options. They have done with all the homework on an addition to that building. Jennifer stated that it is of that building committee, it is done, has been approved by the School Board and they can certainly move forward with the addition because they have been waiting one year for the 60%.

Evelyn stated that there has been an adjustment on the numbers because last year the State aid would have only been 30% and they knew already that it was going up to 60%.

Jennifer stated that it is more waiting for all this information to come back on December 1 otherwise, we are waiting on them.

Peter stated that they were ready to go to the ballot in March with the addition on the ballot. We basically, because we sat across the table after talking about this collectively, they have agreed to wait on making a decision. The School Board is not going to make a decision on whether or not it is going to go on the ballot until the meeting they will have in December. They have to do it in December, because they have to go out and shop for bonds and do all that other stuff and there is a time stamp on doing that.

The only commitment we had to make with them last night was we would commit to them that we would do an analysis of that building. They gave us a blueprint so that we could analyze how much it would cost for us to basically divide that building up.

If you look at it as a skeptic, you really only to put up some divider walls, you really have to divide the PD from the rest. Could the Rec Department and Town Offices be segregated without having to build divider walls, absolutely. So you’re really just talking what you have to do to the building to accommodate the PD. So we need to get this information back to them by December, they will then take that information and at that point our building committee or needs analysis committee we committed that we would have this to them and say we think that the plan of taking makes good fiscal sense.

If this is the case, then they have to decide if they want to wait and work with us on developing that strategy or the School Board may say that we are sorry, we understand that you think that may be a good deal, but we’re going to try to get our school addition. They have that decision to make. Does he think the School Board will run and do something if they don’t see there is a significant fiscal value to the Town to wait, he has to believe that they won’t.

He asked the questions last night, if you do nothing with this year’s ballot, do we put children at risk, do we put the Town as risk from the liability perspective, can we manage the affairs for another full calendar year or two years if we decide not to put something on the ballot? The answer was yes, we will survive, we will find a way to make it work.

Evelyn stated that once you see the numbers, she thought you will see that we will be OK.

Tom G. stated that in terms of being both a taxpayer and member of the Committee that enough due diligence is done by either this joint committee or the School Board on the total package of building a new school. Whether it is K-5 or K-8 because I know from speaking with people from other Towns, the initial stabs is usually very low and very inaccurate because they fail to take into consideration stuff is infrastructure improvements, when you talk about building a school, you’ve got to get the land, you’ve got to get lighting, you’ve got to get sewer, water and you have to get fire hydrants. This just adds dollar signs.

Peter stated that their committee has hired a development team, a contractor and an architect. When they gave the number of between $10 and $13 million that included land acquisition, basically building and development. It did not include things like furniture, this amount basically buys you and builds you a building. It does not do the internal infrastructure of the school. Obviously, we take a lot of what you have, and that was estimated on the size of the population at amount a half million dollars. But the $10 to $13 million that was given is specifically would do with the acquisition of the property and the development of the building. They are using the number of children, State minimum requirements of square footage per child so they did their homework. They did a good job with all that analysis. The best news is that no one is running to do something prematurely.

Peter felt that they are doing what Tom is asking for, not just on the School side but on the Town side. There has been discussions since April kind of focused on doing nothing that would have only the highway and the PD in it. He is not adversed to that concept, however, he is adversed to that concept if there is a more fiscally sound to do that. It makes more sense the PD because it makes more sense to build a Highway garage and that is what we should do. If taking the building is the best way to do it and we gain from the State portion of it, then that is what we should do. We had a really great meeting last night.

Peter stated that there was an article in the Monitor about the State’s $2.5 million in the hole on school aid funding. As of today, they have committed $2.5 million more than they have.

Peter stated that he felt there was a really good groundwork that has been done for a building on the School side. All the documentation that Tom is asking for is readily available from the homework they have done. But so that the Budget Committee knows, the Town commitment is to go back to them by December 1 to say, we think strategically taking that building is economically sound and it is a good idea to house those three things.

There has been talk about building another building behind the Town Hall and turning the front yard into a parking lot. When we sit down before the residence of this Town, we will say, this is why the Town Hall idea did not work. There will be a list of pros and cons, and this is why the school idea did or didn’t work. So if it takes two years to finalize an approach and a plan, that’s ok. Are we at risk downstairs, yes. Are we at risk at the Highway Garage, yes. We are some very deficient issues that need to be addressed. As much as people are in a hurry in a do it, he is also not in a hurry from the standpoint of spending $10 million on a school or $2 million on a safety facility until we know what all of our options are.

Someone brought up that the 36 acres are available on Route 28. He really doesn’t want the school to go there, he would rather see someone build something there that we can collect taxes on. As much as I like the idea for the price tag, which is a really good price tag for 36 acres, he would like to be able to put a manufacturing plant or something out there to get some revenue base.

But you look at the pros and cons, no one has ever built there and no one will ever build there and we need the school, if it is the best location, for 36 acres on the proposal it will say it is the best place to put it there.

If the Town takes the school, what will be done with the Town Hall, I’m not sure. Heating and cooling this building with 20-foot ceilings is stupid. It is old wiring; there is nothing here that is conducive to helping the Town save money. Every year the potential for failure increases with this building. It is a nice historical old building, he would never want to tear it down. We can use it as meeting rooms.

Might you see an item for an addition, yes, but he hopes that they don’t because he feels that fiscally the school idea is a good one, especially with the State funding.

Evelyn stated that the 60% would only work for the Town if the building project were done this year.

Jennifer stated that we should get any update on the space needs committee at each of our meetings.

David J. stated that hopefully the committee will have some numbers on the Highway garage before the end of the year.

The next meeting will be on Thursday, September 23, 2004 we will discuss all the budgets that Dave will have listed on the notice.

Mona made a motion to recess, Peter seconded. The meeting recessed at 9:22 p.m.

NOTE: Although these minutes may contain direct quotes, they are not verbatim. Many sections contain a general description of the remarks of the participants as interpreted as both indicated and not indicated by the transcriber and should not be relied upon as the actual intent of the participant’s statement. Additionally, many statements have been omitted, condensed and generalized based on the interpretations of the transcriber as to its relevance, content, specificity, accuracy, and/or conformity to any applicable statute. The transcriber assumes no liability for the content of this document.